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 Post subject: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 4:43 am 
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Is there any particular fluff related barriers that prevent the old Prestige classes (Disciple of Asmodeus/Beelzebub/Dispater/Mammon) from being integrated into the religious orders you established for The Gates of Hell? If so, what might they be? And if not, how would you integrate them?


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 5:30 am 
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Well, technically, there already conversions of these concepts - meaning, PrCs that represent pne being a servant of a LotN. Dark Cardinal of Asmodeus, Toll Warden of Mammon, etc...


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 5:08 pm 
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I am aware of this. But is there any particular reason why they cannot exist congruently with each other at different ranks within the faith.


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 6:12 pm 
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Well... I personally think it'll be redundant. The classes in tGoH are awesome imo, and the classes within the BoVD were a bit lacking in imagination, if youd ask me


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 7:28 pm 
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I think all of the classes suck, personally. BoVD and GoH. Not so much in their concept, but their execution leaves quite a bit lacking.

The main reason one would use GoH classes with GoH flavor is because some of the devils are drastically different. This is most obvious with Mephistopheles, where the WotC version is obsessed with fire, is personable and charming, etc, while the GoH version is cold, logical and aloof.


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 7:52 pm 
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<3 BoVD Mephistopheles. Basically LE me.


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 9:13 pm 
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I was thinking of using the BoVD classes as a sort of dumbed down or lower ranking OR even alternative societal member of the religious orders in TGoH. For example, Disciples of Asmodeus are essentially Clerics of Asmodeus currently on their way to becoming Cardinals. Three tiers for the 9 motif prominent in the book.

I am a fan of Mephistopheles as well. I'll even be so bold as to say he is one of my favorite Lords of the Nine presented in TGoH. I've taken up a pet project of stating up his consort, Baalphegor as she is never mentioned in TGoH despite being so bloodied awesome, but I am having trouble fitting her into the narrative presented. For example, I cannot rationalize why Mephistopheles would keep a consort of any kind. There are also continuity errors with Baalphegor's history. Specifically that in that in Dungeon Magazine issue #135 they declare that Baalphegor is dead and that her Blessed Angel's serve someone else (presumably whoever wields her Artifact, Baalphegor's Grace), however 6 months later in Fiendish Codex 2, Baalphegor is mentioned as being a member of the Court of Cania.

I am kind of an interest in the Consorts of the various Lords of the Nine and was going to start a thread on the subject to see if anyone would be interested in me posting what I have thus far and knock my ego down a peg or two.


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 10:04 pm 
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Kain Darkwind wrote:
I think all of the classes suck, personally. BoVD and GoH. Not so much in their concept, but their execution leaves quite a bit lacking.


I think I agree. (And since I seem to recall that I designed most of the PrCs in GoH, surely that lends some weight to the argument.)

(Also @ Kain: Ouch. ;) )


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 11:12 pm 
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No offense intended, old chum, I had a hand in more than a few of them myself. They reflect a very different design strategy than I would prefer to play a game under though. Some of the more complicated mechanics could be streamlined...we designed them very much to be read, first and foremost.


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 Post subject: Re: Book of Vile Darkness [Old Prestige classes]
PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 12:31 am 
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Kain Darkwind wrote:
No offense intended, old chum, I had a hand in more than a few of them myself. They reflect a very different design strategy than I would prefer to play a game under though. Some of the more complicated mechanics could be streamlined...we designed them very much to be read, first and foremost.


I've used a few of them and it shows. I tend to streamline them a bit when I use them in play, and if nothing else, the PrCs benefit from having to the point notes to reference.

On a related note, I do think Dark Marshal of Bael and Stoic of Mephistopheles hold up well.


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